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Well, it's very hot here at the Cloud Foundry Day here in Heidelberg, but we just concluded.

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Why don't you introduce yourself?

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Yeah.

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Hi, I'm Nick Kuhn.

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I'm a tech marketing architect at VMware Tanzu, and I do things for Tanzu Application Service

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and Cloud Foundry alike.

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And yeah, you are correct here.

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The temperature here in Germany is much hotter than I expected.

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I miss my United States air conditioning a little bit here.

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The weather's hot, but the water's cold.

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Now, I don't know if this happened to you, but what'll happen is I'll get hot and I'll

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want a refreshing, crisp, clear glass of water.

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And then I'm like, I don't know the difference between a bottle that's blue and red.

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So I'm going to go with the blue one because blue is water, right?

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Yeah, exactly.

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And then you open up the blue water and you take a big swig and you're like, ah!

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It's like I've drunk some water gravel because you got the sparkling one.

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Yeah.

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Which I guess there's people who find that refreshing.

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It's very popular over here.

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Yeah.

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They had a lot of good refreshments here.

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It was just kind of a guessing game, picking what you're going to get there for sure.

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Very well run as always.

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Yes.

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The foundation and the analytics foundation are absolute professionals at running events

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here.

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But what's the, so last time, when, where was the last Cloud Foundry Day?

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Detroit.

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In Detroit, right.

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Now we, we, we had been on, on the Tanzu Talk episode at the time, but we had you report

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about, as I think I called it, the vibe of Cloud Foundry Day.

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What do you, what do you, what do you think the vibe was here?

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Oh, wow.

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I think it was a great vibe today.

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So we, we sold the event out.

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So in-person capacity was, you know, hit the maximum and definitely from the climate control

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for sure.

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So that was great to see, you know, you know, entirely, entirely packed full room of, you

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know, Cloud Foundry users, you know, contributors and that type of thing.

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So it was a very good vibe today.

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Lots of really interesting talks.

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We get some like low level talks, high level talks, so kind of talks for everybody around

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the community and really kind of good to see a great turnout, you know, kind of, I think

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we're really kind of getting past the post COVID, you know, conferencing and people are starting

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to get back out and, and really get, you know, attendance back up.

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For sure.

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And I want to see everybody in person and chat and, you know, do that kind of peer to

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peer, you know, get together and, and I guess, you know, marketing per se and not to, you

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know, see, see what's going on with their peers and community management, community management.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, exactly.

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Yeah.

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You know, I, I think it is, uh, I don't go to as many, well, I don't know.

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I don't actually watch as many conference talks as, as I used to just, just cause I flit

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around doing whatever, but it was fun to see like technical talks.

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And then, and then the thing that I always like to see, well, like to, that's encouraging

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to see in a community is there's actually a lot of, uh, detailed Q and a about like, what

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about this?

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And have you considered that thing?

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So every now and then someone would go over a, uh, a new idea or feature and there would

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be a, uh, uh, a fun discussion about like, oh, well, what's the plan for that?

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Like, how, how do we introduce that?

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Or how do we deprecate this other thing?

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And like, so it's, it's, it gives you that sense of like, there's a, there's a lot of

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like actual work being done.

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Uh, which, which is very nice.

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Yeah.

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So we definitely, you get that sense of, uh, the scale that some of these, these companies

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are working at.

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And then those questions back and forth about, well, how would we actually implement it with,

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you know, X, Y, Z or like, well, you know, that question's rooted in like, you know, serious

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either production use cases or, you know, they've been doing this for however many years and

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like, you know, the very kind of detailed and specific questions.

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So it was great to see that kind of back and forth between the presenters and, uh, you know,

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the, uh, community members and, you know, people would rotate and then, you know, they'd be

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asking each other questions back and forth on, you know, as different speakers would go up

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and that type of thing.

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So, so it was great, great to see that and that community engagement for sure.

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So have you, have you had a chance to catch up with, uh, like, like your people at SAP

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and 89s and other areas?

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Like, do y'all, do y'all have like a secret, like cabals where you get together?

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Oh, I don't, I don't know about that, but I, I would think this is probably the, uh, the,

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the event of the year for sure.

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Uh, um, but yeah, I, you know, I, I flew in yesterday, so I got a few hours of sleep,

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uh, you know, coming from the States.

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So I'm hoping to catch up with some more folks tonight at the reception.

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Uh, hopefully it's a, there's some climate controller in a little cooler setting than

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today, but, uh, yeah, at least some ice cold beverages.

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Yes.

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Yes.

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I think would be in store.

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Plenty of those.

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So in, in your talk, I mean, you, uh, you were highlighting just, I mean, in addition to

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a few other things, you only had five minutes.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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But, uh, you, you went over a lot of good momentum and usage, uh, sort of things

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and, and, and, uh, like go over, I mean, I tell me if I'm wrong, but I think you

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were kind of proposing a type of metric to use.

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Yeah.

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To, to, to gauge efficiency.

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So what, what was it?

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Yeah.

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So I guess we were coining this platform engineering efficiency or, and really that's, uh, equating

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to how many developers can a single platform engineer support.

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And really within, you know, the cloud founder community, we've been doing this thing called

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platform engineering for quite some time.

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Uh, you know, platform as a product was really big, you know, kind of in the pivotal days and,

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you know, running a platform team, that type of thing.

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Uh, so it's really good to see that.

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And we've started kind of, I don't know, I guess, calculating and interviewing our customers

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to start to track this metric and, and see what on average of like the Tanzu application

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service customer base, how efficient are our platform teams and how many, you know, actual

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developers they could support with, you know, X number of platform engineers.

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And on average, uh, I think we see, um, about 190 developers, uh, tied to one platform engineer.

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And then, um, um, from a team perspective, we'll see about six platform engineers supporting about

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1200 developers.

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Um, and even in some of our, you know, really robust customers, we've seen, um, that, that

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ratio go from, you know, a single platform engineer supporting or assigned to 500 or more developers

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within organization.

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And I think that's a kind of a critical metric to track for really any platform.

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But as we talk about, um, how efficient your platform is, how, you know, you know, a cost

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effective, um, that could be.

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Because if you talk about looking at potentially other alternative technologies, are you going

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to be able to achieve the same amount of work and value with, let's say a cloud founding

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platform versus maybe a do it yourself, Kubernetes style, that type of thing.

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And, you know, I've seen firsthand and we've seen some customers chart chart to go down that

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path and that efficiency ratio drastically changes and they end up wiring, you know, we'll

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get to a situation where, uh, more platform engineers are needed to support similar workloads

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on, you know, alternate technologies and that type of thing.

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So that's, that's kind of what I'm keying up on about, uh, the platform engineering efficiency,

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um, within Cloud Foundry.

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Um, and that's, you know, that's kind of highlighted my talk.

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Uh, I did, did, uh, release an article on the new stack about this as well, where we kind

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of dig into, uh, more detail about that too.

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So I'm sure we could put that in the show notes or whatever to link to, but, um, that's

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definitely worth a read if you want to kind of dig into more of that.

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Uh, and definitely thanks for the assistance and, and, uh, and helping

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and helping get that publish and, and, and coaching on that as well.

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Oh yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Well, it's always fun to get, uh, something written out there.

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That, that was a good piece.

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Cause you know, it's, it, it's, it's, uh, the written form of a lot of what you just

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said, right?

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Like, you know, here's, here's a lot of the usage that the, the Cloud Foundry, uh, community

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has like, you know, various, uh, distros of it, so to speak.

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And then, and then also introducing that idea of, of a metric to track, which, you know,

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I, I, I just gave, uh, I gave, I gave the last talk and that, you know, you were making

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me, you're kind of what made me think of be clear about like showing value in the metrics

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that you have.

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Right.

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Cause I think if you do come up with, I don't know, I mean, historically it seems like you

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want to have, it's always an odd number.

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You either want to have one, three or five, seven is a little too show offy, but you want

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to have like one, three or five metrics that you can kind of track across, um, organizations

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to come and, and across different types of platform stacks to kind of like you're saying

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benchmark and compare and contrast what they are.

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And it seems like if your focus is running applications, which is typically done by application

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developers, maybe in the future, it'll be robots that do it right now.

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We've got actual application developers.

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But, uh, yeah, I mean, that is the efficiency, the cost, um, cost is such a weird word, but

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the, the cost versus value that, that you want to track is how much you're putting into a

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developer, an application, or how much, not that you're putting into it, I'm wording it

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wrong, how much you, uh, how much it costs to support each, each developer and the applications

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that they run.

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Yeah.

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Which do you, do you think, do you think we ever like think about developers too much?

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Like, like maybe one day we should invite a developer over and to kind of like de-specialize

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this mythological like thing.

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Cause they're always like, Oh, the developers, we've got to build all the stuff around them

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and make sure their pillows are fluffed at night.

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Well, yeah, so that's an interesting point because I think it, uh, you know, the developer

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experience and getting happy developers, you know, you know, letting them, you know, ship

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code faster, focus on business logic rather than infrastructure, that type of thing.

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I think that's, that's definitely, uh, uh, very, uh, merited and valued, but I think there

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was a point in time where, um, you know, DevOps kind of, you know, became the thing and the

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model was, all right, well, you know, we're slowing things down from maybe a centralized

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IT perspective.

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We're just going to hand out keys to all the clouds and developers.

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You can do everything like you, anything you want to do, you can do, you know, build that,

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but Oh, by the way, you're going to own it.

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You have all the operational burden now that a traditional team might have taken over.

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So I think that's what, you know, what we see like the, you know, DevOps is dead versus

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the platform engineering, that kind of methodology.

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I think we're kind of getting to a point where, um, you know, we need to still take care of

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developers and, and try to deliver things faster for them, um, as like platform teams, right.

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That that's still a value.

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Um, and not just, you know, I think a lot of times two developers will even find coming

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out of potentially like, all right, well, I was a developer and I was given, you know,

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uh, keys to, to Azure and I own, you know, subscription and do whatever I wanted.

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But then I found out I had to do all these things.

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Like how do I get, you know, certificates or, you know, get my workload certified for

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certain security requirements or what's load balancing?

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What about DR plans and backups?

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Like all kinds of traditional IT type things that, you know, platform engineering teams would

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typically take care of that.

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I think that's kind of where we're coming from.

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You know, platform teams are good.

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You need to make your developers happy.

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Um, but you know, you know, things like cloud foundry and other platforms really kind of

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provide a good foundation to, to do that.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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You know, you know, as, as, as you're, as I'm listening to you, it's making me realize

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that like, well, two things.

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One, I've never really good.

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When I think about this stuff, I never really fairly balance out like operations people and

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developers.

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I mean, like, I mean, you know, I used to be an application developer, so I'm developer

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biased, but you know, it's, it's almost like there's a certain, and I guess, I guess

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this is kind of like where DevOps has arrived is DevOps exists for the operators, right?

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Like, like it's a way of making people, whatever you want to call them, sysadmins, operators,

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infrastructure people.

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I think Forrester has a charming, I know, like, like it's some, uh, you know, monopoly railroad

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or something.

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Uh, but like DevOps really caters to and takes care of operations people, right?

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Like it's sort of like gives them tools that are better, automates things, makes what they

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deliver work better, but also like has a huge focus on, you know, like not burning out and

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like having, you know, uh, a good culture in place.

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And I don't know.

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I, I almost just sort of like, don't focus on that at all.

226
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Right.

227
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And, and, and I more kind of focus on the, the like valuable application developer and

228
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just sort of like almost like getting out of their way.

229
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But, but there, there's, there's something, it'll be interesting to see if, if the, the

230
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like new platform engineering community, like kind of figures out how to finally have like

231
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dev and DevOps a lot more than ops and DevOps, which all my old DevOps friends always roll

232
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their eyes when I position it that way.

233
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But like, you know, it, I don't know if we've ever really figured out how to treat each parties

234
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the same in one community.

235
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Like they typically bifurcate into their own little communities to get taken care of.

236
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Right.

237
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But I don't know.

238
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I lost track of my thoughts.

239
00:12:38,240 --> 00:12:43,180
No, I think, uh, I think you can maybe point that to where like the platform engineering

240
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community now, uh, those teams running those platforms can subscribe to DevOps methodology

241
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and tools, but you don't necessarily want your business or your application developers getting

242
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stuck in that world of, all right, I got to figure out, you know, Terraform or Bosch or

243
00:13:00,140 --> 00:13:01,520
all these different, you know, tooling.

244
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It's like, that's not their core focus.

245
00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:08,060
So you really have this like, you know, platform or infrastructure engineers building

246
00:13:08,060 --> 00:13:12,040
things for develop, figuring out kind of all the hard things, all, you know, how to deploy

247
00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:17,720
cloud services, how to wire that up with their security practices, you know, you know, all

248
00:13:17,720 --> 00:13:24,840
those, you know, requirements, um, uh, for, you know, uh, uh, well, I'm blanking here on

249
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the identity management, things of that nature, just trying to get that all taken care of for

250
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developers, uh, so they don't have to worry about that.

251
00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:35,700
And then, and that also provides some control for an organization because if you, if you let

252
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that be on each team, they're going to build the wheel over and over again, it's going to

253
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look different.

254
00:13:40,100 --> 00:13:44,680
And then from a compliance perspective, it's going to be harder to, uh, you know, offer

255
00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:48,460
any kind of guidance or advice if there's something that's efficient.

256
00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:48,860
Yes.

257
00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:50,260
Or it just works.

258
00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:50,640
Yes.

259
00:13:50,700 --> 00:13:50,900
Yeah.

260
00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:54,780
So if you can get something that's efficient and works and provide that as the foundation,

261
00:13:54,780 --> 00:13:57,000
I think that's, that's, that's, that's the key here.

262
00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:03,420
So I, I, uh, uh, so, so, so have you had any conversations about like the, the, how do you

263
00:14:03,420 --> 00:14:03,720
say it?

264
00:14:03,720 --> 00:14:07,540
The, the, the, the Corfee, the running, the running, the Corfee, there you go.

265
00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:09,940
Corfee sounds like a terrible type of European yogurt.

266
00:14:11,380 --> 00:14:13,660
There's, there's a few types we don't have back in the States.

267
00:14:13,740 --> 00:14:15,640
You should try to check out what we're here while you're here.

268
00:14:15,700 --> 00:14:16,780
It's a little, little interesting.

269
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:17,120
Okay.

270
00:14:17,140 --> 00:14:20,900
But, uh, like what, what, uh, there were a couple of sessions on that.

271
00:14:20,900 --> 00:14:24,780
Like, like, like, but what's your, what's, what's Nick's overview of like, what's the

272
00:14:24,780 --> 00:14:27,400
deal with, uh, Cloud Foundry and Kubernetes at the moment?

273
00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:33,120
So definitely the, uh, you know, current iteration is Cloud Foundry Karifi where, uh, you know,

274
00:14:33,140 --> 00:14:38,760
it, it's, it's taking a lot of the core components of the Kubernetes ecosystem and integrating that

275
00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:45,440
directly instead of, you know, previous attempts kind of attempted to shim parts of, uh, Cloud

276
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Foundry into Kubernetes and that didn't quite work out well.

277
00:14:47,900 --> 00:14:53,440
So I think on, from a architectural and engineering perspective, uh, that's a good, a good approach

278
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to take.

279
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And I think we're starting to see some traction with, with Karifi.

280
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So that, that's good.

281
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Uh, we obviously have, um, within VMware Tanzu, we call this the application service adapter for

282
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Tanzu application platform or sometimes, yeah, sometimes we just call it the TAS adapter for

283
00:15:08,680 --> 00:15:13,780
short, uh, to really kind of get that CF push experience still, uh, on a Kubernetes type

284
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platform.

285
00:15:14,160 --> 00:15:17,880
So I think there's definitely interest there as well, but I think we're also seeing

286
00:15:17,900 --> 00:15:24,200
as, uh, you know, value in just the core Cloud Foundry for VMs and how efficient and how

287
00:15:24,200 --> 00:15:30,120
widely deployed that is that maybe, um, the enthusiasm for, you know, just running things

288
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:34,300
on Kubernetes because it's Kubernetes is starting to just die out a little bit in the industry.

289
00:15:34,300 --> 00:15:34,740
Really?

290
00:15:34,740 --> 00:15:37,480
Uh, maybe, maybe that's just my own personal opinion, but I don't know.

291
00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:41,060
Like, uh, I think, well, and then we got things like chat GPT coming in here too.

292
00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:45,300
So it's like, man, Kubernetes, let's, let's talk about generative AI and doing AI things

293
00:15:45,300 --> 00:15:46,040
about with everything, right?

294
00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:47,500
We need Kubernetes GPT.

295
00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:47,920
Yes.

296
00:15:48,020 --> 00:15:48,220
Yeah.

297
00:15:48,340 --> 00:15:49,860
I'm sure no one's ever made that joke.

298
00:15:50,020 --> 00:15:50,200
Yeah.

299
00:15:50,900 --> 00:15:54,740
So I think we're definitely making good progress there.

300
00:15:54,900 --> 00:16:00,920
Um, and, uh, I think, you know, and the Paquetto build pack, uh, project within the Cloud Foundry

301
00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:06,780
Foundation has, has, has got a lot, a lot of, um, uh, growth and we're seeing, you know,

302
00:16:06,780 --> 00:16:10,920
that, that build pack that, you know, that kind of core foundation of some of the Cloud

303
00:16:10,920 --> 00:16:17,160
Foundry tech, uh, from, you know, years ago kind of being re, uh, rebuilt and, uh, re-presented

304
00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:20,620
in a way that's, uh, for, you know, pretty much any use case.

305
00:16:20,620 --> 00:16:26,220
So, um, we even saw IBM has picked up Paquetto as part of, um, uh, I forgot the name.

306
00:16:26,300 --> 00:16:30,080
They had an IBM cloud product that they're, you know, they're starting to use Paquetto,

307
00:16:30,080 --> 00:16:31,900
uh, build packs within their product.

308
00:16:31,900 --> 00:16:34,080
And, you know, you can use it on your laptop.

309
00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:35,120
You can use it within Kubernetes.

310
00:16:35,440 --> 00:16:40,040
Uh, the Cloud Foundry, Karifa uses that, uh, to kind of bridge that gap of, uh, build pack

311
00:16:40,040 --> 00:16:40,400
support.

312
00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:45,820
And we're even rolling some of that back into the, um, Cloud Foundry proper for VMs.

313
00:16:45,820 --> 00:16:49,120
Uh, so that, you know, the OG Cloud Foundry, as you say.

314
00:16:49,380 --> 00:16:52,920
Um, it's getting some of that cloud-native build pack goodness as well.

315
00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:56,340
So I think that's good to see, um, that going forward.

316
00:16:56,620 --> 00:17:00,960
Yeah, I guess, I guess, I mean, this, this, this role doesn't necessarily exist in any open

317
00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:05,680
source role, but if I was doing some kind of like corporate strategy for Cloud Foundry,

318
00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:09,760
it would seem like one of the top initiatives would be like, let's make build pack, cloud-native

319
00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:11,340
build packs, whatever I'll say, build packs.

320
00:17:11,340 --> 00:17:13,640
But like, let's, let's make the build pack idea.

321
00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:17,780
And also whether it's cloud-native build packs, I mean, I guess it would be like, let's make

322
00:17:17,780 --> 00:17:19,800
that big in Kubernetes, right?

323
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:24,560
And so like, even though that's not exactly Cloud Foundry, it's like a Cloud Foundry thing.

324
00:17:24,780 --> 00:17:30,880
And let's make sure that it's like, let's do all we can to make that a major way of configuring,

325
00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:36,880
deploying and packaging, do, doing the thing that it does to kind of like introduce that

326
00:17:36,880 --> 00:17:40,980
into that world and have this kind of, uh, not kind of, but have this similarity between

327
00:17:40,980 --> 00:17:41,660
the two of them.

328
00:17:41,660 --> 00:17:41,940
Right.

329
00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:42,480
Exactly.

330
00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:46,420
And it seems like it would be a good, uh, a good by, you know, it'd be useful for, it's

331
00:17:46,420 --> 00:17:48,400
useful for any application, uh, deployment thing.

332
00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:52,940
And it also be, it'd be useful to like be involved in the Kubernetes community to see what's

333
00:17:52,940 --> 00:17:53,500
going on there.

334
00:17:53,500 --> 00:17:57,200
And then the other way, it'd be useful to kind of like take some of those lessons and the

335
00:17:57,200 --> 00:18:00,860
little, like, uh, you know, positive burrs that come attached to it.

336
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:01,240
Yeah.

337
00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:02,180
Into that world.

338
00:18:02,980 --> 00:18:03,080
Yeah.

339
00:18:03,140 --> 00:18:08,800
So we're, and two on that, that front, we're definitely, um, starting to consume, um, some

340
00:18:08,800 --> 00:18:13,180
of this, you know, newer tech back within the core kind of Cloud Foundry for VMs or teams

341
00:18:13,180 --> 00:18:14,520
of application service as well.

342
00:18:14,940 --> 00:18:18,100
Uh, so within TAS 4.0 released that TAS portal.

343
00:18:18,100 --> 00:18:22,200
So that's kind of an example of where we're taking some of that, you know, that work in the

344
00:18:22,200 --> 00:18:25,620
open state on a different, completely different open source project.

345
00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,220
That's very popular within the Kubernetes ecosystem, but then we made it, you know,

346
00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:31,180
Cloud Foundry compatible as well.

347
00:18:31,180 --> 00:18:35,760
And, and we're offering that, you know, that internal developer platform on top of Cloud

348
00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:39,260
Foundry to kind of help you align even more with some of these, you know, new definitions

349
00:18:39,260 --> 00:18:40,240
of platform engineering.

350
00:18:40,540 --> 00:18:45,480
So we're, we're seeing that, that kind of, you know, pull back within, you know, uh, or,

351
00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:50,300
you know, take, uh, good tech and integrate that back into, uh, Cloud Foundry as well.

352
00:18:50,300 --> 00:18:55,700
So it's exciting to see, uh, those new features and, and how customers can use that, uh, to

353
00:18:55,700 --> 00:19:00,040
help, you know, even, even further, um, enhance their current platforms today.

354
00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:04,900
So I think, I think maybe there's another one, but I think the next big event, at least you

355
00:19:04,900 --> 00:19:07,080
and I probably have is like a VMware Explorer.

356
00:19:07,380 --> 00:19:08,040
Yes, for sure.

357
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:12,800
So, uh, you know, what, what's, what's going to be going on like Cloud Foundry wise there?

358
00:19:12,940 --> 00:19:13,520
Oh yeah.

359
00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:16,740
Well, I believe, I think the number is still correct.

360
00:19:16,740 --> 00:19:21,700
I have five talks at Las Vegas Explorer on different, uh, Tainz of application service

361
00:19:21,700 --> 00:19:22,360
and Cloud Foundry.

362
00:19:22,620 --> 00:19:24,000
You, you do, or there are?

363
00:19:24,100 --> 00:19:25,760
No, I, I personally, yeah.

364
00:19:25,840 --> 00:19:26,060
Wow.

365
00:19:26,240 --> 00:19:30,980
And then, uh, you know, we, uh, we, we did our best to try to get, I think, uh, as many

366
00:19:30,980 --> 00:19:35,040
slots and, and, and airtime as we can for, for TAS and Cloud Foundry.

367
00:19:35,540 --> 00:19:40,400
Um, because I think it's a great product and we, we need to talk about it more.

368
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:44,480
Just, uh, just, you know, just because it's not Kubernetes doesn't mean it's not awesome

369
00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,080
and we don't have a bunch of, uh, awesome customers and use cases to talk about.

370
00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:53,580
So we, we've got a couple of panel sessions lined up, um, where some of our customers, uh,

371
00:19:53,580 --> 00:19:58,560
I've got a talk within the kind of SpringOne talk, uh, what SpringOne track, uh, where

372
00:19:58,560 --> 00:20:01,780
how, uh, you know, meet the expert sessions that you can come, if you have questions and

373
00:20:01,780 --> 00:20:07,160
we can, you know, you know, open, you know, open mic type style, you know, uh, ask any

374
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:07,840
question you want.

375
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:11,380
So there's going to be a lot of, uh, definitely a lot of Cloud Foundry and Tain's application

376
00:20:11,380 --> 00:20:16,320
service coverage in both, uh, Explorer of Las Vegas and Barcelona this year as well.

377
00:20:16,320 --> 00:20:21,440
And then the Barcelona call for papers is still open for, as we record this, June 21st, for

378
00:20:21,440 --> 00:20:22,220
three more days.

379
00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:22,400
Yeah.

380
00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:26,240
So I, I, I am hoping we, we, we should get good covers there.

381
00:20:26,340 --> 00:20:26,560
Yeah.

382
00:20:26,580 --> 00:20:26,840
Yeah.

383
00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:30,500
But definitely, I think, I think especially for the, a lot of people who are here, right?

384
00:20:30,500 --> 00:20:33,320
Like if, if they get a chance before the 24th of June.

385
00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:33,920
Oh yeah.

386
00:20:33,920 --> 00:20:37,860
I think, I think there's, uh, like a lot of, I mean, I don't know, maybe even some of the

387
00:20:37,860 --> 00:20:43,120
talks that were given here would be a nice, uh, to have there, but definitely there's, there's

388
00:20:43,120 --> 00:20:49,700
always room for, uh, more, more Tanzu application service or PCF or TAS or Cloud Foundry talks.

389
00:20:49,700 --> 00:20:50,040
Yeah.

390
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,320
Uh, to have at those events in, in lovely Barcelona in November.

391
00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:54,840
So it won't be crushingly hot.

392
00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:55,240
Yeah.

393
00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:56,820
It'll be mild.

394
00:20:57,140 --> 00:20:57,580
Mild.

395
00:20:57,960 --> 00:20:59,080
And slightly breezy.

396
00:20:59,220 --> 00:20:59,660
Yes.

397
00:20:59,700 --> 00:21:01,160
But still, still a short time.

398
00:21:01,740 --> 00:21:05,500
Well, uh, any, any other reflections from the day before we wrap up?

399
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:07,640
Uh, no, I was just, it was a great day.

400
00:21:07,720 --> 00:21:09,540
Great to see, uh, everyone turn out.

401
00:21:09,620 --> 00:21:11,740
I got to a lot of meet, meet a lot of people.

402
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:15,020
Uh, I haven't met yet before besides, you know, just Zoom, including, you know.

403
00:21:15,180 --> 00:21:15,500
Sure.

404
00:21:15,580 --> 00:21:16,960
Meeting you yourself in real life.

405
00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:18,380
So that's, that's, that's cool too.

406
00:21:18,540 --> 00:21:20,220
Um, but yeah, it's just, it's good.

407
00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:24,800
It's good to see, you know, the community chatting and I enjoyed to see, you know, uh, we had

408
00:21:24,800 --> 00:21:28,980
a, uh, uh, Tanzu customer event last night, kind of pre-reception to see all that, you

409
00:21:28,980 --> 00:21:30,780
know, our different customers kind of chatting with each other.

410
00:21:30,860 --> 00:21:34,460
So that's always good to see and having that opportunity to kind of connect directly one

411
00:21:34,460 --> 00:21:34,780
on one.

412
00:21:34,920 --> 00:21:39,760
And I'm sure we'll do the same with, uh, both, uh, both VMware Explorers to get, you

413
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:45,160
know, kind of detailed one, you know, uh, TAS dedicated, uh, customer events as well.

414
00:21:45,460 --> 00:21:45,600
Sure.

415
00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:46,360
Yeah.

416
00:21:46,520 --> 00:21:49,740
Well, as always, this has been a episode of Tanzu Talk.

417
00:21:49,740 --> 00:21:52,500
No video for this episode, which, which is, which is nice.

418
00:21:52,660 --> 00:21:56,360
I can, you know, uh, I've, as, as Nick has had to suffer through, I've, uh, picked my nose

419
00:21:56,360 --> 00:21:59,240
and gotten, gotten meat out of my teeth several times.

420
00:21:59,360 --> 00:22:02,460
Uh, things like that kind of, uh, cleared out my ear.

421
00:22:02,540 --> 00:22:04,200
I could go on, but I won't.

422
00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:08,100
Uh, but if you want to get the, the show notes like that new stack article we mentioned, see

423
00:22:08,100 --> 00:22:09,940
how to subscribe, uh, things like that.

424
00:22:09,980 --> 00:22:14,540
If you go to TanzuTalk.com, uh, you can find all of that and we'll see everyone next time.

425
00:22:14,620 --> 00:22:15,140
Bye-bye.

426
00:22:15,340 --> 00:22:15,580
Bye.

427
00:22:15,580 --> 00:22:15,600
Bye.